In his latest “Sunday Show” with BizNews, United Independent Movement (UIM) President Neil de Beer names the Flop of the Week & the Hero of the Week; tells viewers why Angie Motshekga is not competent to be Minister of Defence; hails the extradition of Mike Lomas on graft charges; previews the looming vote for – or against – Tshwane Mayor Cilliers Brink; slams the huge tariff increases ESKOM wants to inflict on consumers; explains why the growing crisis of extortion is economic terrorism; and warns that the “Faceless War” now being waged in the Middle East – where exploding pagers and walkie talkies caused carnage in recent days – could also reach individuals in South Africa. “…what will happen if there are certain targeted individuals, they leave the Middle Eastern area to go to other places like South Africa…; they are then going into our societies, yet those devices are still methodologies of war and what would happen if they explode them here?

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Highlights from the interview

In a recent interview on the Sunday Show with BizNews, Neil de Beer, President of the United Independent Movement, discussed key issues in South African politics. He expressed disappointment over the Springboks’ close loss to Argentina and shifted focus to the political landscape.

De Beer identified Angie Motshekga, the Minister of Defence, as the “Flop of the Week,” criticising her incompetence, particularly regarding missed opportunities at the Aerospace and Defense Week Show in Tshwane, where crucial permits for U.S. military participation were not issued on time. He highlighted the negative implications for South Africa’s defence industry and border security.

Conversely, he praised the National Prosecuting Authority as the “Hero of the Week” for successfully extraditing individuals involved in major corruption cases, including those related to Eskom, a state utility struggling with financial mismanagement and proposed significant tariff hikes.

De Beer also addressed the ongoing political rivalry between the Democratic Alliance and ActionSA in Tshwane, expressing concern that the political strife is neglecting citizens’ needs for basic services. He emphasised that the focus should be on serving the community rather than power struggles.

Finally, he tackled the rise of extortion, labelling it “economic terrorism,” and shared alarming statistics on the low prosecution rates for these crimes. He concluded by discussing the evolving nature of warfare, particularly in the Middle East, underscoring the potential global ramifications of current conflicts.

Extended transcript of the interview ___STEADY_PAYWALL___

Chris Steyn (00:05.933)

Every week has its villains and its flops in South African politics. Let’s hear from Neil de Beer, the President of the United Independent Movement. Welcome to the Sunday Show with BizNews, Neil, your show.

Neil De Beer (00:24.174)

Our show, the People’s Show. I think last week we just got over 80,000. Good morning, Chris. But unfortunately today I can’t be full of bravado by our Springbok rugby team. We lost 29-28 with one point to Los Pumas, Argentina. We’ll take this one and I hope that we recover. So to everybody, don’t worry. We can’t dump and be a good supporter by just one loss. So come on South Africa. We’ll take it back next time. Yeah, Chris, what a week. And I think we’ve got a lot of things to talk about.

Chris Steyn (00:59.217)

Why don’t we start with the Flop of the Week?

Neil De Beer (01:04.466)

Oh absolutely, this is very easy. And I’m very, very sorry and sad to say that this is starting to become a pattern. So our Flop of the Week undoubtedly is Angie Motshekga, the Minister of Not -So -Good Defence. I think you will remember that when she was moved from the Basic Education Portfolio to Defence, I vehemently objected and I said that if there is a moment in time that we need to look at our internal and external defence structures where we need to get four entities right. It was Correctional Services, it was Police, it was Justice and undoubtedly Defense because it doesn’t help that we look for example at getting our promotion of our defence services, the discipline back in the army and our borders supported by the military and have a absolute incapacitated and incompetent person leading it. Angie Motshekga is not competent to be a Minister of Defence. I think if you ask her what is the classification and understanding of defence, she’ll tell you it’s the thing about, she’ll say well you know I think defence is the thing around by house. What a lot of nonsense. So we needed someone that at least has military experience.

Now again this week…Here we go. We are having the Aerospace and Defense Week Show in Tshwane. And here there’s blunder. While everybody in the world has conjugated to come together in Pretoria for probably one of the biggest defence and military shows that we put on, the Department of Defense under Angie Motshekga is too late to allow the United States of America and their divisions of military and armament to get their permits in time to appear at the show.

Now, Chris, the impact and why I’m very much saying she’s the Flop of the Week and must take responsibility is one of the biggest eras, one of the biggest industries, one of the biggest results of an economy in the United States is defence one of the biggest industries, one of the biggest results in the economy in the United States.  It is the military equipment. It is the exchange of industry ideology and to showcase what they’ve got. Now, we used to be, I say used to be, one of the leaders within the defence industry structure through Denel Armskor. Now, we both know that in the era of the Guptas, in the era of the SOE collapses, the most tragic scenario in my experience was the failure and the absolute shredding of the intellectual property and capacity of DENEL, a leading entity at one’s time in the 70s and the 80s, where they produced some unbelievable military technology.

Neil De Beer (03:58.442)

And this year, we have to showcase everybody, but the biggest buyer and seller of defence equipment is the United States. They bungle it. They can’t get their permits issued so that these people could come in. So absolutely, Flop of the Week. Opportunity missed.

And I’m sorry to say, but we will have to actually focus on ensuring that pressure is put on that department, because this is a leading department, not just for trade and industry, but for the protection of the borders of this country. no, so Flop of the Week in my opinion.

Chris Steyn (04:46.938)

Neil, do you think there’s a possibility that she deliberately acted to exclude the US here? And that it wasn’t just incompetence?

Neil De Beer (04:55.576)

Well, we don’t know. Well, we don’t know. I mean, just incompetence number one and number two, if it was done on purpose, it was very weird that while this defence show was actually starting to happen, she was sitting in an Eastern bloc country with their military junta. That’s very weird to me because there was a picture of the start and the buildup of the defence show. And then you see a picture of her sitting in a certain Eastern bloc country, probably talking about other matters. So I don’t know these days, you know, the mixture between incompetence, the mixture of priorities. And I’ve always said, if you look at an institution, an organisation, get your priorities right. And we’re going to address something today, which is huge, which is the massive explosion of extortion. And again, it’s about priorities within budget, between ministers and between effective policing. So, so, I don’t know if this is just a situation where Angie at this current moment is out of her depth, but I can tell you the morale in the defence force…There are certain units in this Defence Force that are currently engaged in combat, I’m telling you, north of South Africa, where that morale is even worse. And if I were, I would stop flying to the Eastern block and I would take a chopper and go to Mozambique and go visit my men and women there.

Chris Steyn (06:20.337)

On a more positive note, Neil, who have you picked as the Hero of the Week?

Neil De Beer (06:26.744)

So, Hero of the Week, in actual fact, this week is not a person, but an organisation, and I will call it today. We always chastise this organisation for obvious reasons at times, but this week I will give the feather in the cap for not the Flop of the Week, but in actual fact, the Shining Star of the Week, which is the National Prosecuting Authority, NPA.

People will say, why? Well, something’s happening, Chris. And I hope this that is happening will now continue to happen because it’s about bloody time. And I’m giving the Star of the Week Award to the National Prosecuting Authority because this is now the second individual they have now successfully extradited to come back to South Africa and to stand for the sins that they allegedly created.

So you would remember two, three weeks ago, we had the PA of the now infamous Mr Ace Magashule that was brought back to this country to give evidence in his fraud and corruption trial. And this week we saw the return of the accused in the ESKOM scenario, Mr Lomas, accused of being part of an indicated syndicate that stole more than 1.1 billion rands worth of contract fees within ESKOM.

So I must tell you, although big pomp and ceremony, you, you can see the cameras and the police and everybody at the airport and the countdown, but bloody right, so name, shame, bring them back.

And I cannot wait. And Chris, here’s my absolute promise, heard first here, that the day that that NPA announces that the Gupta brothers are coming back to this country also, shackled and in shame. I stay in the Cape Province, but I give you my word, I will fly up personally to be at that airport on the day that the Guptas are going to be brought back to this country. And I don’t think I’ll be standing there alone.

Chris Steyn (08:43.887)

I think they’ll have to find the Guptas first. Last time I checked, their whereabouts were a mystery, Neil.

Neil De Beer (08:51.086)

No, I think we know where they are. Make no mistake. I think we know exactly where they are. They’re no longer in Dubai. They were conjugating in India. They ran a bit like cockroaches. And the only good thing, apparently a cockroach can withstand a nuclear blast, but I’m willing to pay for 15 tins of Doom to kill those cockroaches. So I think be, be under no uncertain terms. I think they know exactly where they are. It’s just taking too long. It’s just taking too long time in my opinion, not fact. I think it was not just done because of our incompetence or because of the time frame.

I think there was at one stage no political will to bring them back. But with this new aptitude and attitude of the NPA, with our new Minister of Police, and hopefully we can get that clarified, we should tell them, Guptas, come home for a bit because we would love to entertain you under a questioning session.

Chris Steyn (09:52.281)

Meanwhile, the political battle for control of South Africa’s capital has been characterised by a very bitter and ugly war of words between the Democratic Alliance and ActionSA. You are close to Mayor Cilliers Brink. What can you tell us?

Neil De Beer (10:10.99)

Now, I wouldn’t say I’m close, but as you know, I’m a fan. I’m unequivocally, unashamedly a fan of Cillliers’ work because I know his work. I also know the other side. I have deep connection with ActionSA because I served on the Multi-Party Charter leadership with many of them. And may I tell you what a past week of trilogy enactment of Better Starring of Hollywood of To and Throw. We’ve had more than 83  Twitter X, Instagram, and mainline News articles from both sides, 83 this week past, of Herman, Michael Beaumont, ActionSA putting down their statements, and a huge volume of counter from Tshwane, Cilliers Brink, and now the DA that launched a campaign, Chris, last week, Tuesday of all the executive mayors, for example, of the DA doing a media clip presentation saying Save Tshwane, Save Cilliers Brink. So no doubt that has been the week of the two parties trying to justify or blame the other.

Now, the deadline is set, Chris. The Last Waltz will be on the 26th of September in the Tswane Metro Council when the vote for the vote against Cilliers Brink will now be cast. It was the statement from Herman Mashaba that said that they are either going to go and declare a new coalition with the ANC or they are not going to vote and they would go into the opposition benches to face against that coalition.

Neil De Beer (12:09.134)

But what is very clear is that this thing stood out. Tshwane has been on the top 20 list of newsworthy items, the number one, two, three, four and five for the past three weeks.

I want us to just step aside, Chris, and just remember one thing and I want to say it from a person that understands government, that understands politics, that’s not a specialist in it, but I have been part in it for more than 32 years.

Neil De Beer (12:38.594)

They always say when two bulls fight, it is the grass that suffers. The grass in this case is the citizens. It is you and I. It is the people that sit in Tshwane and do their rates and taxes, that want their bloody lawn cut, their rubbish collected, their water to flow, their electricity to be engaged, and their sewage and water services, sanitation to be clear, and not have pothole.

Neil De Beer (13:08.706)

Hey! This is what it’s about. It’s about nothing else than the people whom stay in that Metro that actually deserve, nay, demand that they just get services. It doesn’t actually matter, Chris, who the hell it is. If it’s a Cilliers, of ‘n Peter, of ‘n Sipho, of ‘n Douglas. I don’t care.

Neil De Beer (13:38.84)

What must be clear is that whomever governs must put the citizens first. And I’m very sorry. In the past three weeks, it has absolutely not been about the citizen. It is about power. Now, power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely. So I think we are full of shit now. Yeah, that’s it. Full of shit. We are full of shit of seeing the political show, the political puppets, the political rah-rah rhetoric, I cannot wait for the 26th so that we, not just as Tshwane, not just as Gauteng, but as South Africa, can go away from the table tennis match to bloody getting down to services and serving your citizens. And I think we’re getting there on the 26th of September. Come what may.

Chris Steyn (14:31.523)

Neil, talking about full of shit citizens, may we have a look at the tariff increases that the power utility ESKOM wants to inflict on us?

Neil De Beer (14:44.526)

And we actually gave a Star to the ESKOM chair last week. And I don’t take away that star. I’m not going to because we spoke about the character of Mr. Mteto Nyati, the person, the individual. And then they come…because I think the order of the day is more than a 40% increase.

Chris Steyn (15:02.705)

I think it’s 36 for direct users and 40% for municipal.

Neil De Beer (15:09.142)

Madness, Chris, again we are trying to, and I’m clear about it, we are trying to bail out a very, very dark and very blatantly bankrupt entity in all sense. In other words, we know that there’s a differentiation between the cost of trying to save, run, operate ESKOM. And then there’s that question about what is the actual physical cost to generate power out of ESKOM. Hear me? Well, there’s a difference.

The operating capability budget to run the entirety of ESKOM, all its three divisions, generation, power distribution, etc. and staff costs, that is the salaries, the capacity. Then there is the physical actual cost to company. In other words, what does it cost Eskom to generate and supply power? The one is not the same. So if you look at the general cost to daily supply power to us, there’s X, and then to run, pay, solve, manage and debt recovery of Eskom is obviously a different amount.

The problem is if they had to write off all that debt, which is in the billions, and if they just had to focus on giving us power, the 35 and 40% would not be necessary. But that’s not where we are. ESKOM is sitting with a massive conundrum. They’re sitting with debt that is in the billions, which includes municipal debts to them. They’re starting to throttle them now, but are going to get huge resistance.

They’ve got to, as Mr. Nyati said, they have to currently maintain the old machines. They have to create the new machines and they have to physically look at where they are in power generation. Remember what he said, once we can get supply stabilised, we can then go to phase two where we can say, can we drop the rate and the charge for power.

Neil De Beer (17:36.32)

Now they’re not there yet. So I think the shock that we are getting is that there is a desperate attempt to try and on our back, yes, on our back shoulder as citizens, to do all of that which I just told you, because we know it. We were in a presentation where they have to do all of that.

Chris, here’s the crux of the matter. This is going to hit the poor. That’s a fact. This 35 and 40 is going to absolutely damage the poorest of the poor in this country. Not the middle class, not the upper class. Those people will continue to make the effort to sustain power. But I’m afraid that we have now gone a bit over the border of the poverty line in the actual people that are at the lowest of the low, being able to get what I would call in modern terminology, a basic essential, and that is electricity.

So yeah, I see there’s a lot of organisations standing up against it, but there we are, Chris. It is the onion and the apple. The onion is the bitter taste that we need to recover ESKOM and the apple is that I think we might get to a positive side if we rethink and if we work things out.

Chris Steyn (19:05.664)

Just turning to crime, Neil, extortion has become the go-to, or it seems to have become the go-to quick money scheme for many criminals. Is there even a way in which this can be addressed effectively because it is a growing crisis?

Neil De Beer (19:25.58)

Yeah, the only way to address it is to attack it. I think this country, I think you, I think our great viewers of this show, knows where I stand with crime. But yes, yes, if we may stand still on this. I don’t call it extortion. I call it economic terrorism.

And let me clarify why this week when I made that statement, the media went, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, Listen to what I’m  saying because I come from there. I understand that beast as you know.

The format of extortion, the end goal is cash. Make no mistake, the end goal is capital. Be it to extort you so that you pay me, be it to extort you to get a contract, or be it there to extort you to get a tender. Extortion is a format and way for you to gain capital. The way to do it is to terrorise that target to comply. The terror methodology is either they come there, they threaten you or they kill you or they kill someone in your establishment. That’s it. They do that blatantly. And we have seen the cases both. So if that is the modus operandi, then it is terror. It’s terrorism. So it is blatant economic terrorism currently.

Neil De Beer (21:06.274)

Now, let me quickly tell you the stats because I like stats. You know, we could all sit as armchair people and they give a comment. You know there are a lot of them. And we can say, but no, no, I like stats. So here’s the stats. And these stats was presented this past week at the Parliamentary Portfolio Committee of Police under the chairmanship of Ian Cameron, a good colleague of ours, I call him, well before he became that. And I’m always interested in his point of view because he’s a young dynamic man who actually understands the process.

Here’s a frightening stat, Since 2019 to 2024, just over 6,000 cases of extortion were registered at SAPS level nationally. Out of the 6,000 cases of extortion that were registered this period of time, more than 2 780 arrests were made based on the 6,000 cases that were lodged. Here’s the shocking statistic. Out of the 2 780 cases that were made, arrests followed. Listen to the amount of prosecution: 178 successfully prosecuted. Chris, this is shocking: 178, can I tell you that amounts to 3%. So you are saying that out of this massive attempt to now probably stop one of the greatest scourges of crime in this country, we’ve only had a prosecution rate of 3%. Now there’s a flag, there it is. There’s one of your biggest flags.

Neil De Beer (23:03.534)

Number two. I don’t know if you know it, but currently more than 25 billion rands worth of infrastructure contracts had to stop in the past two years because of extortion: 25 billion. So it has an infrastructural impact as well. So it’s not just a criminal process that is impeding us. It is not just a criminal and death scenario.

Neil De Beer (23:31.096)

But it also has a major economic scenario where we can’t do infrastructure. So just looking at that, no wonder that the Deputy Minister of Police, Minister Boshielo, got up and said, we as the SAPS, and this is a public statement, are under-resourced, under-equipped and underfunded to currently rise and fight extortion.

Chris Steyn (24:03.999)

Let’s hope they get the funding and the resources they need, Lastly, may we briefly go to the Middle East where Israeli intelligence services pulled off an operation that has left me breathless. What did you make of it?

Neil De Beer (24:22.808)

Yeah, Chris, I mean, you know, one of the things…and please, you know, I’m quite known for having a bit of a huge humour. South Africans and I find the world are starting to treat very horrendous situations with humour and the memes and the short clips that went out in the world after this incident. I actually understood. No.

Chris Steyn (24:49.659)

They don’t bear repeating here Neil, let’s not repeat them.

Neil De Beer (24:52.918)

No, but I was sitting and going, do we know where we are actually? That it has become a matter where people had to seek comic relief to actually get away from the absolute, absolute horrendous situation in the Middle East.

Now, Chris, on the serious side, this is a total different level of war. You know, people like myself and probably many people that are watching of my age, we come from an era where we still had what you call conventional warfare. Now I was part of the Bush War. Many of us were. We partook in the Angolan War. In the Angolan War, the South African Defense Force at that stage had the capability of doing two things. We could fight a conventional war, which means your statutory forces, your infantry, your artillery, your Air Force. That strategy, that’s conventional. But we also had the ideology of being able to fight the hit-and-run war. In other words, strike, retreat, strike, retreat. We perfected the Bush War. So that kind of warfare, Chris, we understand.

But what is currently happening in the Middle East has gone way beyond conventional warfare. And it has gone to what we now call the era of the faceless attack, the war without face. In other words, the era of electronic warfare where you don’t physically square up to the enemy, where you don’t physically get battle forces to concede that this is the battleground, this is where we’re going to fight it out, and then you have the tit for tat. No, no. Chris, we are going to an era where drones, in other words faceless, where electronic media, as we now understand it, like fundamentally a cell phone, a pager, a two-way radio, that that has become the new instrum ent of war.

Neil De Beer (27:11.692)

And in my opinion, when a person, and, Chris, I talk for experience, when you could physically see your enemy, face your enemy, and actually fight your enemy, in my opinion, Chris, that was war. That was, and I know it’s going to sound terrible, but that is when there was still gentlemen, when there was still a bit of honour within warfare, where you physically met the enemy.

Neil De Beer (27:40.706)

The humanity within that also came to bear. Not only us soldiers that were in war can understand what I’m talking about. I’m trying to talk to the people that were never there. When you see the face of your enemy and they are defeated, or you are defeated, funny enough, in many cases, there was that era of compassion. This is war, therefore you’re a soldier, you’re fighting for a cause.

But now that you can say that there is a pager, a pager on a human’s belt, a radio in his house – we were even talking that, you know, when is it going to TV remotes, electronics, things that you use basically every day have now become a bomb, and that you can sit at a certain point and push a button and across your borders in another country, people die.

This has escalated, in my opinion, now further than just saying to ourselves that countries are at war. And it’s a thin line, Chris, no matter your politics, I don’t care for your politics. I’m saying that this is going to escalate to a point where I think the Russia-Ukraine war, who also, by the way, are using technology of drone bombs and drone technology. But what happened this week has gone far beyond, I think, many people’s imagination. We’re going to have to watch that because your Iran, your Hezbollah, your Palestinian organisations that are currently sitting like Hamas, your Israel, and Israel is not backing down. They are escalating.

So what you’ve seen this week happening across the Middle East, I think has taken that war to a next level and it’s concerning. Because what will happen if there are certain targeted individuals, they leave the Middle Eastern area to go to other places like South Africa or France or Germany or America, they are then going into our societies, yet those devices… are still methodologies of war and what would happen is if they explode them here.

Neil De Beer (30:04.576)

That brings it a bit further than the borders of the Middle East and I’m concerned it comes home. So we will have to be concerned about that. Just because it’s in the Middle East doesn’t mean it’s not here.

Chris Steyn (30:24.913)

Thank you. That was Neil de Beer, the President of United Independent Movement on this Sunday Show with BizNews. Thank you, Neil, and I owe Chris Steyn.

Neil De Beer (30:37.004)

Thank you, Chris.

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